Blowers?

[Extinct SS]

turtle said:

That car looks like it was a lot of fun ;D. Sweet ride man, what happend to it?

I sold it after i bought my SS. Put a narrowed disc 9" under it with 29x18.50's tucked nicely under the fender wells. It had 2 holley 850dp's fed by a mallory 140 fuel system

['68SuperchargedLT1Camaro]

extinctss said:

I used to have a 66 cutlass that had a 455 with a 671 GMC huffer. heres some crappy pics of it off a vhs i have of it. God i miss that car

Man, I bet that car was fun! I had a '67 SS Chevelle with a 396. I really miss that one.

Raymond

[justin95ta]

i have a kinda off the wall question. a guy i talked to where we all meet up before going out to race had a TPI with a kennie bell. i would rather have a roots style blower if i could but been unsuccessful up to this point. if i cant find on i plan on a turbo kit from either STS or ProTurboKit.com. if anyone knows if they make roots style blowers for the LT1 please let me know

[Fire67]

justin95ta said:

i have a kinda off the wall question. a guy i talked to where we all meet up before going out to race had a TPI with a kennie bell. i would rather have a roots style blower if i could but been unsuccessful up to this point. if i cant find on i plan on a turbo kit from either STS or ProTurboKit.com. if anyone knows if they make roots style blowers for the LT1 please let me know

Why would you prefer a roots blower? They make the most heat and are the most in-efficient. IMHO turbos and centrifugals are hands down the best power adders.
Pro Turbo kits makes the best turbo kit for an LT1 f-body but has a LOOOOOOOOOOONG turn around time. Procharger makes the best centrifugal kits ive seen.
Nobody makes a roots style blower that will fit an f-body car.

[Extinct SS]

well hopefully the 5th gen makes it to production then the magnacharger will fit. Been used on the C5 and Monaro/GTO and made great power

[DarkHorse]

Running an V2 SQ Trim @ 7lbs on the car in sig. Install is not complete yet - I have a couple more things to tie up. Will post track results when completed. Not really a dyno numbers guy myself.

[justin95ta]

fire67- i would have to assume that by turn around time you mean the tiime taken to install it. i would just be ordering it and installing it myself with my friends help who knows alot about turbos. i have also thought about the procharger kit if i change my mind and go with a supercharger. at the moment its turbo all the way for me for many reasons, 1 you can run through every gear without any boost= less stress on engine, 2 capable of producing more HP than a supercharger, and one of the most fun reasons is no one knows you;ve got it til you leave some little ricer wondering WTF just happened cause he couldnt hear til you mashed the gas. however i dont want anyone to get the wrong impression supercharger are a great source of power and sound bad@ss at idle or full throttle.

[Fire67]

By turn around time i mean over 6months of waiting to get your kit after you par for it in full
As for your reason #1... You can also run through every gear without ever seeing boost with a supercharger. Just cause its belt drive doesnt mean it has to boost at 6000rpm. In fact, when I was running a Powerdyne it wouldnt see any boost unless I went WOT, with the procharger I get maybe 1-2psi when going through the rpms at less than WOT.

Finally, I dont care what size turbo you run, you will be able to hear it at cruise and idle speeds. Only cars that came factory with turbo seem to have the luxury of not hearing it. Thats because they have special intake and exhaust plumbing to quiet down the turbo, which you will not have if you build a turbo LT1.

[94m6hardtopz]

justin95ta said:

fire67- i would have to assume that by turn around time you mean the tiime taken to install it. i would just be ordering it and installing it myself with my friends help who knows alot about turbos. i have also thought about the procharger kit if i change my mind and go with a supercharger. at the moment its turbo all the way for me for many reasons, 1 you can run through every gear without any boost= less stress on engine, 2 capable of producing more HP than a supercharger, and one of the most fun reasons is no one knows you;ve got it til you leave some little ricer wondering WTF just happened cause he couldnt hear til you mashed the gas. however i dont want anyone to get the wrong impression supercharger are a great source of power and sound bad@ss at idle or full throttle.

youve obviously never had a blower, ive had both. they both have pros and cons. for most people a blower is a better way to go. after you buy your turbo kit and get fed up with it, let me know. ill buy it for pennies on the dollar. ;D

[justin95ta]

you would be correct i havent had a blower, i know people that have and they liked it without much question, but they were all drag racers so it worked out really nice. i on the other hand am a road racer and have been one since i went to germany and raced nurnburg ring and hockenhiem ring (for anyone who is not familiar with those tracks they are the same ones F1 cars race on). so the blower is gonna hurt me more than the turbo coming out of a corner, not that it wouldnt help me in other parts of the track, but the turbo would actually work better for this, since there will undoubtly be turbo lag, i will have more of a chance to get out of the corner before i start getting most of my boost. if i was all about drag i would have a blower and most likely the procharger kit. i dont expect everyone to understand my reasons for goign with the turbo, but if anyone seriously road races at a track not runs down a few twisty streets and think they know everything about taking corners then they probably get it.

[Fire67]

Ive done quite a bit of road racing, and I think that if you ever drove an american car through the Nurburgring you'd appreciate a blower...

[justin95ta]

i was there for two years with my TA and i have driven it, while i was there public was only aloud to run a couple miles not the full track and its a wide open track lots of space for any poweradder. im refering to tracks like pacific raceways, bremerton, etc.

[94m6hardtopz]

justin95ta said:

you would be correct i havent had a blower, i know people that have and they liked it without much question, but they were all drag racers so it worked out really nice. i on the other hand am a road racer and have been one since i went to germany and raced nurnburg ring and hockenhiem ring (for anyone who is not familiar with those tracks they are the same ones F1 cars race on). so the blower is gonna hurt me more than the turbo coming out of a corner, not that it wouldnt help me in other parts of the track, but the turbo would actually work better for this, since there will undoubtly be turbo lag, i will have more of a chance to get out of the corner before i start getting most of my boost. if i was all about drag i would have a blower and most likely the procharger kit. i dont expect everyone to understand my reasons for goign with the turbo, but if anyone seriously road races at a track not runs down a few twisty streets and think they know everything about taking corners then they probably get it.

its actually easier to control your your part throttle midrange rpm boost with a centrifical then with a turbo. the wastegate makes it all or nothing. turbo lag is a non issue on todays well designed kits with modern turbos.

my turbocharged mustang 5.0 stated spooling up at 1900 had 6lbs of boost by 2200, 12lbs by 2500 and 18lbs by 2800 when i turned the boost up all the way. my vortech car didnt startmaking boost until mid 3000s.

now, you can hook up a 2 step rev limited on a blower car and at wide open throttle it will leave with full boost. a transbrake will do the same thing. both blowers and turbo need load to make boost, but the blower you can manipulate more with different pulley and engine rpm. where as the turbo doesnt care, if its got the egt and the wastegate is closed, its gonna spool and you are gonna have a big power spike on your hands.

having both, given the choice, for road racing. id prefer the blower. but, for road racing id perfer NA over a power adder because its not gonna hit the tires coming out of a corner like a turbo will and a centrifical might.

just for reference, my old turbo car made over 600lb ft of rwtq at 3000rpm, whereas my blown 302s torque curve was more gradual.

[impaladave]

I have a 1996 Black Impala SS with a forged 355 running 10lbs non of intercooled Vortech generated boost.
400.6 RWHP
435 RWTQ

Dave

['68SuperchargedLT1Camaro]

impaladave said:

I have a 1996 Black Impala SS with a forged 355 running 10lbs non of intercooled Vortech generated boost.
400.6 RWHP
435 RWTQ

Dave

What's up Dave! Good to have you over here buddy. Stick around.

Raymond

[impaladave]

What's up! Thanks for the warm greeting, I look forward to getting into the mix ;D. I see there's a few of us LT1Tech guys here, should be fun!
By the way, anyone using Alky injection? I am concidering it over an AIR/AIR intercooler because of the cost, plumbing issues, lower intake air temp, and no boost loss across the radiator intercooler.

Thanks,
Dave

[impaladave]

Fire67,
You got 450RWHP with 8psi on the stock motor!WOW!
I can't get that with 10psi on my forged, ported head, 355
I was running out of fuel, and I'm non intercooled so the tuner must have pulled out huge amounts of timing to compensate for the detonation.
Any theories? I have a fortune into this thing, and was looking for like 450-500 at the wheels.

Dave

[1bad2k2ta]

impaladave said:

Fire67,
You got 450RWHP with 8psi on the stock motor!WOW!
I can't get that with 10psi on my forged, ported head, 355
I was running out of fuel, and I'm non intercooled so the tuner must have pulled out huge amounts of timing to compensate for the detonation.
Any theories? I have a fortune into this thing, and was looking for like 450-500 at the wheels.

Dave

I think that is exactly right. Are you sure you are not already seeing knock retard? You should not attempt to run any boost if you do not have sufficient fuel pressure and volume. Even a good conservative tune can not overcome insufficient fuel. You will go lean and you will get detonation. No question about it. Even a forged motor can't take this for long.

[impaladave]

d@mn man, you got me beat by a mile with 6psi. This is depressing! I am running a tad lean from 5000 to 6000 rpm, and am installing a walbro 255 to correct the problem. I believe he pulled timing to prevent detonation, and ran it rich on the low end to try to keep up at the higher rpm. Would I be better off short shifting at 5500 and advancing timing. Somewhere, I am off on power, and I would rather build more power with less boost.

Thanks,
Dave

[1bad2k2ta]

impaladave said:

d@mn man, you got me beat by a mile with 6psi. This is depressing! I am running a tad lean from 5000 to 6000 rpm, and am installing a walbro 255 to correct the problem. I believe he pulled timing to prevent detonation, and ran it rich on the low end to try to keep up at the higher rpm. Would I be better off short shifting at 5500 and advancing timing. Somewhere, I am off on power, and I would rather build more power with less boost.

Thanks,
Dave

If you know you are lean at 5000 rpms, don't go there, don't even go close to it.

The Walbro should be sufficient. What size injectors are you running?

The only way to make more power and less boost is to eliminate airflow restrictions.

Tell me about your exhaust system, cam, and heads.

Boost is resistance to airflow. A freer flowing exhaust will help. Heads will make a tremendous difference.

If you didn't know this already, you will find out soon enough. Forced induction is not cheap, at least not if you do it right and want your motor to live. How much it costs depends on how much power you want to make.

[impaladave]

I'm using 42# injectors. I'm not sure if you've heard of Clear Image Automotive, I have their Quad 1 Cerama Chrome longe tube headers with random technology cats, then out through an American Thunder(flowmaster cat back).
I have ported and polished stock heads with 1.6 Crane Gold race roller rockers.
Comp Cams
LT1 XR269HR-12
SN# UG9728
Dur@50 218 in 224 ex
Lift .495 in .503 ex, but because of my 1.6 roller rockers,
Lift .528 in .536 ex
Lobe Sep 112
Heads flow .241@.500 intake/182@.500 ex(not great, but good)
My motor is a forged 355 with studded mains and (Callies)Billet caps.The pistons are Lunati forged pistons with Speed Pro rings.I have a 52 MM Holley Throttle body, Edge 3000 Stall, and bought LT1 edit for the dyno tuning.
I know about the $$$, I built a new motor and spun the mains at 300 miles, now I'm on motor #3.

Thanks for the input, It's appreciated.

Dave

[1bad2k2ta]

impaladave said:

I'm using 42# injectors. I'm not sure if you've heard of Clear Image Automotive, I have their Quad 1 Cerama Chrome longe tube headers with random technology cats, then out through an American Thunder(flowmaster cat back).
I have ported and polished stock heads with 1.6 Crane Gold race roller rockers.
Comp Cams
LT1 XR269HR-12
SN# UG9728
Dur@50 218 in 224 ex
Lift .495 in .503 ex, but because of my 1.6 roller rockers,
Lift .528 in .536 ex
Lobe Sep 112
Heads flow .241@.500 intake/182@.500 ex(not great, but good)
My motor is a forged 355 with studded mains and (Callies)Billet caps.The pistons are Lunati forged pistons with Speed Pro rings.I have a 52 MM Holley Throttle body, Edge 3000 Stall, and bought LT1 edit for the dyno tuning.
I know about the $$$, I built a new motor and spun the mains at 300 miles, now I'm on motor #3.

Thanks for the input, It's appreciated.

Dave

I am assuming the car is an Impala. Do you have the cast iron or aluminum heads? The injectors should be fine. The 112 lsa is hurting you some. What is the diameter of the y-pipe. You haven't run and leaded high octane gas have you?

[impaladave]

I'm not exactually sure what you mean as far as the gas goes. I run 94 Octane at all times, and retard my own timing when the weather is on the warm side.
I'm not sure about the Tubung diameter, but I'll check.

It's not that my car doesn't screw (it does), but Fire67 is getting 50hp more than me with a stock LT1. This leads me to believe that at 10psi, and after the many thousands of dollars in head work, line honing, balancing, and parts, I am getting beat out by N/A Strokers and stock SC motors .

Dave

[1bad2k2ta]

impaladave said:

I'm not exactually sure what you mean as far as the gas goes. I run 94 Octane at all times, and retard my own timing when the weather is on the warm side.
I'm not sure about the Tubung diameter, but I'll check.
It's not that my car doesn't screw (it does), but Fire67 is getting 50hp more than me with a stock LT1. This leads me to believe that at 10psi, and after the many thousands of dollars in head work, line honing, balancing, and parts, I am getting beat out by N/A Strokers and stock SC motors .

Dave

I asked about the leaded gas because it can clog up the cats and screw up the O2s. Are the heads aluminum or cast iron?

[impaladave]

I have the cast iron heads.

Dave